Primers at Widener's

[abcollector]

I found some primers at Widener's! They are Wolf brand but primers nevertheless. They have most of the Wolf line there at the moment.

Has anyone used them here and what was your opinion of them? Good enough to at least get one though the shortage?

[JohndeFresno]

I found some primers at Widener's! They are Wolf brand but primers nevertheless. They have most of the Wolf line there at the moment.

Has anyone used them here and what was your opinion of them? Good enough to at least get one though the shortage?

Here is one link from CalGuns - California Guns blog - where a responder states that the primers are similar to American brands:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/show ... ?p=3054175

There are similar responses with various handloaders, and depending upon the cartridge, some are reporting that Wolf primers are a bit milder than their competitors.

So you might have to adjust your loads for this, bearing in mind that no matter what somebody says, you must start at a safe, lower load and work up to your loads - usually suggested as 10% of a given load at the safe "maximum" listing.

Now - if I had to get some primers in a pinch, I'd get them if I couldn't find others. In fact, I would have, were it not for Rimfire.

Have you tried using the excellent ANVIL bot available from Rimfire McNutjob (a fellow Levergunner)? He has graciously offered the use of the primer searching software at no cost, believe it or not. I have all the primers I need, now, for the next year or two - thanks to him.

[wadeestes]

How would I get access to the ANVIL bot program?

Thanks,

Wade

[Hobie]

Anvil is a program that searches various online retailers for primers.

You'd probably be surprised at how often primers are going in stock at retailers
and you just miss them. I will often see five primer types come in at two or
three of the online retailers each week. The problem is that they are only in
stock for an hour or sometimes less. By the time you get home, you've missed
them. You may have even signed up on the retailer's site for email alerts on the
primers you're looking for. Unfortunately, those alerts are often only processed
once a day and mostly at night while their servers aren't busy. A primer you
have been looking for can come and go from stock within a 30 minute period and
if you're using those alerts ... you'll never know it happened. Anvil
was written to solve these issues.

You converse with Anvil via email. Your email must be formatted as text and not
HTML. You must be registered to use Anvil or your email requests will be
ignored. If you are registered, you may send your commands in the subject line
of the email you send back to Anvil. Anvil is up and running unless I've taken
it down to fix a problem or add a feature. Even if Anvil isn't up, your email
will get queue at the server and Anvil will process it when I bring it back up.
For the most part, you should get a response to an email back from Anvil within
a minute or two ... often quicker.

Operating Anvil ...

The valid subject items are: Help, Insert (or Add), Update (or Set), Remove (or
Delete), and Status (or Show or List). Each of these are described below. These
are not case sensitive, nor are any of the other
items.


Help

"Help" as the email subject or a subject line that Anvil doesn't understand will
get you the email you are reading right now.


Status

Status (or Show) will send you an email that contains your current settings in
the Anvil database. This includes the brands and types for those brands of
primers that you are currently looking for as well as any optional notification
email address other than the one you are registered with. If you haven't setup
any primer searches yet, you'll get an email back that simply says "No
entries.". If you do have something setup you will get an email back that looks
like the following:

From:Anvil@dangly.com
Subject:Status

Any:LR, SR

CCI:SP, SR-Mil

Notfy:1234567890@cingular.com

This shows that the system is looking for Large Rifle and Small Rifle primers
for you from "Any" manufacturer. You are also looking for Small Pistol(#500)
and Small Rifle MilSpec(#41) from CCI. The names of the manufacturers you may
use are "CCI", "Fed", "Rem", "Win", "Wolf", or "MagTech". You may also use
"Any" which means any of the above or you may use "USA" which means any of
"CCI", "Fed", "Rem", or "Win". Of course, you can also say "Remington" or
"Winchester" if you want, the system will recognize the first few letters and
assume which one you meant.

The primer types supported use generic names as follows: "LR", "LRM", "LR-Mil",
"LR-Match", "LRM-Match", "SR", "SRM", "SR-Mil", "SR-Match", "LP", "LPM", "LP-
Match", "LPM-Match", "SP", "SPM", "SP-Match", and finally "SPM-Match". Not all
makers have all types. In particular, Federal has most of these except for the
"Mil" variants which are unique to CCI as their #41 and #34. CCI doesn't have
the Pistol Match types that Federal makes, etc.

There are a few short names for primers. For example, "LR*" means any type of
Large Rifle primer ... including Large Rifle Magnum and all of the other
permutations. The type "LR+" means only Large Rifle and the Mil and Match
variant but not to include the Magnums. If you used "LRM+" you would mean Large
Rifle Magnum and all of its variants ... which is to say Large Rifle Magnum
Match. As an example, "SR*" means as follows:

Small Rifle, Small Rifle Magnum, Small Rifle MilSpec, Small Rifle Match, and
Small Rifle Magnum Match ... the last one being made by Federal only. If you ask
for a primer type that isn't made from a particular supplier, that request will
just be ignored and all other reqeusts will remain valid.

If you have registered an optional Notification email other than the normal
email you are registered under, that will display as well in the Status response
as the "Notify" item.


Insert

Insert (or Add) as a subject email needs to contain a set of search terms and
perhaps a "Notify" term which will all get added to the database for your userID
(email address). An example email might look as follows:

To:Anvil@dangly.com
From:myself@mydomain.com
Subject:Add

Any:LR*
CCI:LR+, SP
Remington:SR+

Notify:1234567890@vtext.com

If you sent the above email from your registered email account to Anvil, you
would get back an email showing the following:

From:Anvil@dangly.com
Subject:Re:Status post Insert

Any:LR, LRM, LR-Mil, LR-Match, LRM-Match

CCI:LR, LR-Mil, LR-Match

Rem:SR, SR-Match

Notify:1234567890@vtext.com

As you can see, you are now looking for any Large Rifle type of primer from any
of the makers ... both domestic and foreign. You are also looking for any of
the Large Rifle (non-Magnum) primers from CCI, as well as both types of Small
Rifle primers from Remington.

Let's say Anvil finds that Winchester Large Rifle (#8-1/2) primers are in stock
at one of the online suppliers ... like Natchez for example. This is what will
happen: Anvil will send you an email to your registered email as well as an
email/text message to your Verizon phone at (123)456-7890 telling you that
"Natchez @ (800)251-7839 has Win LR(#8-1/2) for $25.99/k". After Anvil sends
the email to the server, it will remove your request for type "LR" primers from
the Any category. Your search for the other types of "LR" will remain in the
Any group, and your search for "LR" specifically from CCI will also remain
intact. Had Anvil found CCI LR(#200) primers, Anvil would have removed the
search from both the Any and CCI groups. Anvil will assume that once it has
notified you, it is done with that particular primer type. If you aren't able to
contact the retailer and order after you've been sent the notification, you'll
need to re-activate (Add or Insert) a request for that particular item again.
If you send a request for a primer search and Anvil sees it as in-stock
somewhere, you'll get an email back immediately and that request will have been
satisfied.

Of special note is the Notify item. This can be any email address. However, if
you're like me and you work all day, this email address can be the SMS text
message queue for your cell phone. When the message comes, it will have the toll-
free number of the retailer included and will list all of the primers that you
are looking for that they have and their price per thousand. Since the message
comes to your phone, you may be able to call them immediately at the number
given and place an order for the primers that Anvil has listed. Keep in mind
that most also have shipping and hazmat charges that get tacked onto the price.
Given that, you may want to order at least 3000 to help defray those additional
charges. Obviously, if you have a friend looking for the same primers, you can
split the cost, etc.

The Notify section is the critical piece of Anvil. If you're away from your
computer / email, you'll probably miss out on the opportunity to buy the primers
you're looking for. I've seen stock vanish in as little as 15 minutes from a
retailer that listed stock. An email address that you check after you get home
from work is going to be pretty useless. If you use one of the following
carriers, these are examples of how to format an email address that will send a
text message to your phone:

T-Mobile: phonenumber@tmomail.net
Virgin Mobile: phonenumber@vmobl.com
Cingular: phonenumber@cingularme.com
Sprint: phonenumber@messaging.sprintpcs.com
Verizon: phonenumber@vtext.com
Nextel: phonenumber@messaging.nextel.com

... where 'phonenumber' is your 10 digit phone number. Using this method, when
a retailer posts stock on a primer you're looking for, you should know about it
on your phone via an SMS on average about 75 seconds after the item(s) show in
stock. Random luck is the only thing that will allow some schmo that happens to
be surfing and looking at the page to beat you there.


Update

Update (or Set) operates very much like Insert (or Add) for the purposes of
setting up a search. However, when you send an Update or Set command, the items
you list will be the only items you are searching for. All of the other stuff
will get overwritten for the brands you list. However, if you send an Update
for CCI let's say, and you have a line in your profile that's looking for
Federal primers as well, that line will remain and not be distrubed. If you send
an email to Anvil that has the following line:

To:Anvil@dangly.com
Subject:Set

USA:*

You are then basically looking for any type of primer from any of the U.S.
manufacturers ... CCI, Federal, Remington, or Winchester.


Remove

Remove (or Delete) will take your search criteria and remove it from your list.
As usual, you'll get a status email in reply showing what the database contains
for your remaining search terms ... if any. If you want to wipe out all of your
search terms, just send Anvil a "Status" email and wait for the reply. When the
reply comes back, change the subject to "Remove" and send it back to Anvil and
that will wipe away everything that Anvil sent you.


Ad Nauseum ...

Anvil is written in C# (pronounced See Sharp). This program hits the various
primer sections of the various online retailers, parses the HTML pages for those
areas into Document Object Model (DOM) trees. Searches the trees for the proper
part numbers used by the retailers and finds the associated stock status and
price. It searches the sites about every 2 mintues. When it finds an item(s)
that has changed status, it looks through the database of search requests by
user and finds people looking for those primers. Each user that is looking for
these get's an email and also potentially an SMS messge transmitted via SMTP
(Simple Mail Transfer Protocol) to their phone. During the several seconds that
Anvil isn't searching the retailers, it's looking for emails via the POP3
incoming mail protocol for requests from users (like you) to update their search
terms or get a status.

Thanks for using Anvil. --Bill

[SteveR]

abcollector,

I bought a bunch of the Wolf brand primers about 2 years ago, (and am glad I did!), they seem to be pretty good. I would wait if you can for CCI or Winchester, but if you need some now they would be ok. I see the prices are 11-12 dollars more per 1000, from when I bought them.

Steve

[Rimfire McNutjob]

How would I get access to the ANVIL bot program?

Thanks,

Wade

Send me a PM with the email address you want to use it with. I will load it into the access table and it will send you the Help email. Then you can setup your search requests. I currently have it ignoring MidSouthShootersSupply. They post stock often that they don't really have and it causes a lot of false positives. Apparently, they fill all of their backorders through their website so the stock will show up for a few minutes even though it's destined for a backorder.

[AJMD429]

MidwayUSA just now has Remington 6.5's (small rifle) in stock, and some Fiocchi (sp?) or other.

No other Rem, Win, or CCI's that I could see there.

[COSteve]

Wolf SRM primers work very well in my 357mag for my leverguns. Been using them since the magnum primers were available. Some friends tried the SR primers and weren't that excited about them but we all agree that their SRM primers work well.

[jengel]

I have several cases of Rem 7.5 small rifle benchrest here at the shop. Sorry, won't ship, you have to come here to see me.

[Triggernosis]

I use the Wolf SRM primers exclusively in my .223 Service Rifle loads. The magnums aren't really "magnums" in the sense that we're used too (i.e hotter flame, etc.), but simply have a harder cup - perfect for the AR15 with its floating firing pin. The .223 primers are magnum primers.

[abcollector]

I have received the Wolf primers I'd ordered from Widener's and have loaded real close to a hundred .357 magnums with a 180 gr LBT bullet. I've shot probably about forty of them and have been pleased with the primers in the way that they work. However, I have noticed over the chronograph a high extreme spread but I can't really compare to a different SPM primer 'cuz I don't have any at the moment. Only powder I've tried so far has been IMR 4227. I have some other powder I'd like to try but just need to get some time.

I'd buy them again if the regular brands weren't available.

[abcollector]

I have several cases of Rem 7.5 small rifle benchrest here at the shop. Sorry, won't ship, you have to come here to see me.

That's just cruel jengel!