First 30-30 mold

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Camel73
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First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

My 94 slugged at .3085 and it's got a long throat.

I was thinking on treating myself to a brass noe ranch dog .311 165gr gc 2 cav w. pins.

Others on the list are two lee's; .311 rb and the 113gr gc "soup can" to round out my 30-30 casting needs.

What do you think?

Edit: ok maybe not a brass one. Ill probably stick it together...
My first child - '94 30-30
M. M. Wright
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by M. M. Wright »

Sounds good to me. What diameter are you planning to size them to?
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by earlmck »

I'd say that will do you very nicely. Of those mentioned I have the Lee "soup can". Fine bullet which I would use more of except that I have a 6-cavity in the Ranch Dog 32/20 bullet that turns them out so much faster than the 2-cavity that I end up using the 117 grain Ranch Dog bullet for everything, just sizing ..313 for 32/20 and .309 for all the others. I would size .310 or .311 except that I have one 300 Savage that doesn't chamber anything larger than .309 so I just simplify life and size for it and none of the others object too bad. If I only had one 30 cal I would size to whatever the throat diameter would allow to chamber easily.
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1894cfan
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by 1894cfan »

Yup, those ought to do. Have fun. :mrgreen:
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

.313 took a decent squeeze from the lfcd to chamber with the rb's. Once I got a .311 push through (actually .3105), more than one problem disappeared.

I phoned noe and asked if they could make me a mold with a 165, 115 and rb. No joy. Called lee, they're on lunch for another hour.

I noticed last night there were three 165gr versions and one was an "updated" tumble lube. Nice.
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Shasta »

For a heavier bullet, take a look at the Lyman 311041 mould. I use it for metallic silhouette shooting and find it to be very accurate.

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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Chuck 100 yd »

What Shasta said + 1 ^^^. I have a dozen or more .30 molds suitable for the .30-30 but none of them outshines the Lyman 311041.
The Ranch Dog designs are very good but need to be cut into better quality molds than the Lee double cavity molds to produce high quality castings. Maybe its because all my double cavity molds are of their early design and the newer ones would do better, I don't know.
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by gundownunder »

I'm not a fan of Lee molds, bought a couple of them and won't buy any more. I am a fan of Accurate molds.
I already have Accurate molds for my 32-20 and 357, and will shortly be getting a mold for the 30-30 that I was just offered. It is a Marlin microgroove, so will be looking at getting .310 - .311. Fortunately with Accurate you can get the size you need based on the alloy you use. If looking at Accurate molds There are a couple that might be worth looking at. The 31-165-D is a Ranch Dog style, and the 31-170-JG was apparently inspired by the 311041.
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Thanks guys.

That accurate mold site is crazy! I just came up for air.. so many...
Accurate has combo molds yes, if it doesn't include rb's.
Lee's out too.

So I just came back home with a Lee 2 cav 113 gr gc mold. I figure it'll be good to learn on and get to know my sizes with different mixes, before I dive in on a super mold I guess.

The more I search around, the more I realize I dont know. Maybe that's a good thing. :roll:

Oh ya, I was gifted a revised 2nd ed. lee reloading manual last week too. That was a neat read. I was actually expecting data for his own molds but, guess not. I'm such a noob. Ha. I should go over it again.

Haven't decided on a heavy yet. Where's the point of diminishing returns at say, 50 - 75 yards? And how long of a chunk o lead can I actually stick into the case? Noob, I know, I know...
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by gundownunder »

Lee's second ed is a very useful book to have, as is Lyman's cast bullet handbook.
The Cast Boolits website will give you information overload.

As far as what bullets fit, in Lee's book you have drawings and dimension data for the cartridges, on Accurate's site you have drawings and dimension data for the bullets. Finding a bullet that will fit is basic mathematics.
It doesn't become rocket science until you add the propellant :lol:
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Image

So I threw a stick on ww into my chamber and this is what I got.
Seems like the rifling was closer than I thought it was.
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Griff »

Picture didn't come thru for me. I prefer my Saeco #316 which throw my alloy to about .310, which I then gascheck & size to .309. Gives good accuracy for range out to about 400 yards... I've shot to 500 meters, and while it'll bang steel with fair regularity, I ain't sure some of it ain't luck. Throws about a 156gr bullet with gascheck & lube applied.
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Hmmm, let see if this works.

Image

Griff, 400 yards! I'd be happy to get half of that.
I plan on using the little guy for higher velocity applications if I can.

My melting pot should be here this week.
Just need to decide on a powder. I've got trail boss but i don't believe that's going to get it where I think it could be.
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Griff »

Camel73 wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2017 8:19 pmGriff, 400 yards! I'd be happy to get half of that.
I plan on using the little guy for higher velocity applications if I can.

My melting pot should be here this week.
Just need to decide on a powder. I've got trail boss but i don't believe that's going to get it where I think it could be.
IMNSHO, the .30-30 can be plenty accurate at velocity with the rifle powders that others have traditionally used... BL-C(2), IMR 3031, 4064, 4320, 4350 & 4895, RE 7, & 15, or Win 748. There are even more choices... enough to drive one crazy. When I first started reloading... I started with the 44Mag & .30-30, both in lever action Winchesters, and pretty much stuck to what my Lyman's 45th Loading manual said was the most accurate load in their testing for the weight bullet I was buying. (Always jacketed). And what I found was that when my load shot to the same POI of a factory load in that same weight, I had pretty close to the most accurate load. I tried all the above powders except BL-C(2) & RE15. When I started casting for the .30-30, I had a goal to reach the same POI as my jacketed loads. I have now got there with 3 of those powders, but generally stick to RE7 because of it's ease in metering. However, I'd not want to discourage anyone from experimenting with their own rifle and loads... as it/they, may have other favorites and goals.
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

That reminds me, I've got to do some homework on an available powder that's good for cold/hot temps.

Well, good thing I didn't lay down any cash for some type of long nose design mold for a heavier bullet at first. I don't think it would have fit... I would have been choked for sure.

My little cast iron pot should be here tomorrow or the next day. I'm pretty excited lol.
I just got the firepit cleaned out and a few hours worth of wood at the ready.

One thing left is gas checks.
There are none in town so I have to order them or make them.

Other than that I think I'm ready.
Maybe I should get my hands on some different heavier design lead bullets to check my tolerances.

Oh ya, a ladle!
My first child - '94 30-30
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by JFE »

Most leverguns chambered for rifle cartridges have short throat / no throats, as per your throat impression. The main exception that I can think of is the 375 Win. However leverguns in pistol cals generally do have long throats. It's best to pick bullet moulds that were designed for leverguns, i.e. pay attention to throat, OAL and crimp position. Fortunately the 30/30 has a long neck and a case capacity that is well suited to cast bullet shooting.

With the variety of weights you are looking at just be aware that the bullets will likely shoot to widely different POI and adjusting sights can become a real chore. One of the posters mentioned they were after a load that shot to the same point as their full power jacketed load. This would be a good thing to aim for IMO. This is generally achieved with heavier cast bullets at higher velocities. I use 748 with the Lyman 311041 and not only is it accurate, but it shoots to the same point as factory loads, making it an easy proposition to use.

Good luck with your journey.
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Thank you JFE, I'll take a little luck any day :D

I've never been worried too much about having to adjust my sight, as I already have a pretty low velocity round that's easily adjusted for with the Lyman peep.

Also, I like the idea of a more frangible, high speed light lead. Possibly less prone to far reaching ricochet.

So, in only dealing with a smaller weight 30-30 projectile (that doesn't have a crimp groove), I haven't come across any heavy(long) bullet/short throat scenarios to play with.

I've seen one for sure but I'm wondering if there are any heavier designs that are more suited towards a shorter throat... to end up at, say, 190gr. I kinda want to check out that lvr powder load.

I've been trying to get a few different nose designs and weights to play with, but no joy yet.

I just cast up some ww ingots last night to use the 113gr mold today, but it's been too spotty with showers. I been itchin to get that mold going!

Not quite sure on the whole bullet depth into the case thing yet..

Jeepers, it never ends.. All in good time I suppose.
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Rusty »

If you have a special want you might want to try calling Lee on the phone. Years back they had a .429 mould in their catalog the looked like an LBT mould. I called them to ask if they had the same mould without the gascheck. They answered right back and said that someone else had already asked for that same mould and had in fact paid for the cherry to be cut. If I wanted that same mould I would have to pay retail for the mould plus $10 for a custom order. What a deal! Just because it isn't in the catalog doesn't mean it can't be done.
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Hey Rusty. Good deal man!
Mine's chambered in just the lowly 30-30 (special to me!), but thanks for the heads up on Lee.

I spoke with someone there regarding a mold I wanted made about a month ago. Even though they did have the 3 cherries for the designs I wanted (actually their own..) they still were asking me for over $250 for a 4 cav. Kinda took the wind out of my sails.

I'm a poorboy shooter.
The mri for my neck and back is only a month away. I've been waiting for it for a year and a half. Money's been tight fer sure but when I get this diagnosis finished with I get to go back to school. Yay! ha
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by 3leggedturtle »

It's hard to go wrong with Lee 113FP. It has accurately in about 13 different .30cal rifle and pistols. At 900fps you can shoot a squirrel and eat the bullet hole! Todd
30/30 Winchester: Not accurate enough fer varmints, barely adequate for small deer; BUT In a 10" to 14" barrelled pistol; is good for moose/elk to 200 yards; ground squirrels to 300 metres

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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Lol, nice.. I can't wait to start messing with loads and alloys for the 'ol soupcan.

Since I'm all geared up to cast+load with pretty light gear I figure on doing some terminal ballistics research of my own while out camping for a week and just keep shooting the same lead. My ww haul netted me about 70lbs of clip on and 30lbs of stick on. I also got lucky on a pound of pewter. That should keep me busy for a bit.

My current low vel load is a rb at around 800fps.
My plans for the 113gr flat nose was to have a speedy zapper.. if possible.
Next, (once I finally settle on a heavy design) was to work on a big game load.

Literally loads of fun! and, the different tips will help me distinguish between each load.

Gotta go on another wood run..
Making all those little ingots ran me dry!
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Image

I keep getting drawn to it... it's.. beautiful :shock:
Could I use it?
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Canuck Bob
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Canuck Bob »

I got your PM today. I'll answer soon but I have a 32 Special not a 30-30.

My question is regards your slug. It appears to be a throated chamber. My 32 has the rifling going to the chamber neck ramp. Yours has it ending before the ramp, indicating a chamber throat. Best sizing would be the diameter of that throat portion directly in front of the case neck ramp to start. If it is a throated chamber you are likely to get good results.

i would recommend the RCBS 180 gr mold designed for the 30-30 first mold. It is very often recommended. It is good to start with a known profile that has lots of help and experience available.

Edit: Just bumped into this thread on the Boolit site. Read post #4, outstanding!

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... -half-full
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Ahhhh sweet. Thanks for the info Canuck Bob.

#4, Lol, ya that guy is awesome. His posts come up often in my daily readings, and usually puts a subject to rest.

Well, it's .3095" just before the rifling.
I own a .311" Lee push through (.3105" actually).
It looks like my .311 sizer is going to get a new little brother.

I won't decide on a mold for a heavier design until I can play with a few cast bullets first. Ya, got a touch of ocd. I find the bullets I pulled from Federal? factory loads are tough to get a reading from because of the crimp groove.

No worries though, as I'm getting ever so close to breaking in my new little guy. I kinda feel like a little kid at Christmas. With diameters and ogives dancing through my head...
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by w30wcf »

Camel,
The .305 diameter would be a problem in chambering since your groove diameter is likely closer to .301.
Bullet 31--160t would be a much better choice or something similar to it.


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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by KirkD »

gundownunder wrote: Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:14 am Fortunately with Accurate you can get the size you need based on the alloy you use.
I've become a big fan of Accurate Moulds for that reason. I've ordered all mine in brass and prefer that over aluminum or steel .... it just seems easier to me to keep the mould at the proper temperature, and I don't have to worry about rust. You specify the alloy and what you will size them to, and he cuts them accordingly.
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by marlinman93 »

I have a half dozen Ideal or Lyman molds for .30 caliber, and all are great shooting bullets. They range from lightweight plinkers to very heavy bullets. But my favorite is also the #311041 Lyman, as it seemed to work best in my old guns.
I don't even own a .30 caliber presently, but I never sell molds, so hope someday to get another one!
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Camel73
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Re: First 30-30 mold

Post by Camel73 »

Thanks for replying everyone!
I genuinely appreciate all your feedback.
I have nobody to discuss any of this with other than reading and you guys so I appreciate any help I can get.

Image

Well, my very first batch with the lee .309-113gr :D

So I started with straight coww's ac'd, then I quenched a bunch.
Using my mini cast pot worked better than I thought but it was so windy I almost gave up.
These came out at .311-115gr.

Once I started to get the hang of it I got some soww going in a bigger pan. Ac'd half and quenched the other half.
These came out at .311-118gr.

I haven't added any tin yet. I basically wanted to play around and get my feet wet.
Pretty good first experience.
I learned a lot, and good thing I did a heap of reading first.

Between the fire getting low, the wind storm, my huge ladle, the sprue screw coming loose, mix getting too hot (nice colors though!), and the mold getting too hot (which I don't actually mind).... Wow! I thought to myself, this is awesome!!

I did a nail test today and I can't put a dent at all into the quenched co bullets.

I realize not adding tin to the mix had me not filling out the mold entirely a lot of the time, as you can see the bases are a little rounded, but for the first go round, it was a good learning experience.

Image
My first child - '94 30-30
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