.218 Bee reloading questions
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.218 Bee reloading questions
Ok, so I got a NIB first year (1990) 1894CL, for what the MSRP was in 1990. Also picked up a mint 1983 Leupold M8-4x for $20, to mount on it. It was a dumb luck day.
I've read all sorts of load data, but it doesn't seem to be inconsistent in the manuals.
I have plenty of new Hornady brass, plenty of 2400, 4198, N110, and 4227. I'm going to using the Speer 46gr jacketed flat nose bullets. Plenty of Winchester small rifle and small pistol primers
Here's my questions, for you guys that reload .218 bee. This is just going to be a range toy.
1. Does it make that much difference in accuracy by using small pistol verses small rifle primers?
2. Out of the 4 powders listed above have you noticed any major accuracy differences, one over the others.
3. Have you noticed any major changes in accuracy using reduced loads verses ones that are near the published max?
BIG THANKS in advance!
I've read all sorts of load data, but it doesn't seem to be inconsistent in the manuals.
I have plenty of new Hornady brass, plenty of 2400, 4198, N110, and 4227. I'm going to using the Speer 46gr jacketed flat nose bullets. Plenty of Winchester small rifle and small pistol primers
Here's my questions, for you guys that reload .218 bee. This is just going to be a range toy.
1. Does it make that much difference in accuracy by using small pistol verses small rifle primers?
2. Out of the 4 powders listed above have you noticed any major accuracy differences, one over the others.
3. Have you noticed any major changes in accuracy using reduced loads verses ones that are near the published max?
BIG THANKS in advance!
I know a whole lot about very little and nothing about a whole lot.
- AJMD429
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
No info from me, cuz I'm still shooting up my factory loads I bought so I'd have some brass, but I'm gonna watch this thread...!
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- Sixgun
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
You paid what it originally cost? You STOLE it! I'm the only one allowed to do that. Just for that, I'm sending you for an appointment with the proctologist who is void of Vaseline.
I too have a 218 Marlin and I affectionately call it my "cat rifle" but I've never shot a cat with it, only a mess of foxes and it drops them on the spot. My favorite all time load is 11.5 gr. of 2400 with the Hornady 45 gr. Bee....specifically made for the 218 Bee....... 12 grains of 4227 will do the same..... for a chronographed velocity of 2599. It's a tad under top velocity but I've learned a long time ago if you load just a little under, you don't lose much velocity, the animal don't know the difference and the brass lasts a lot longer as leverguns are less forgiving on high pressures than bolt guns are.
Do NOT use pistol primers for two reasons....one, they don't cost any less and two, the Bee cartridge is a high pressure cartridge and is small and 2/10th's of a grain increase will increase the pressures a whole lot more than they will in a larger case and you don't need gases blowing back through the primer in your face. The only time I would say it's OK is when your using cast gas checked bullets with 3 grains of Bullseye which I've done also with complete success. Even then I use rifle primers as the pistol primer is also a shallower primer which could lead to a light primer indentation which might lead to a misfire. The 218 Bee brass is deep measured for rifle primers.
I have always stayed with the 11.5 load as it works......1" at 100 and if I want something with less power, I'll use a .22 L.R. I've shot crows and foxes out to 150 yards with the Bee.....have it sighted dead on for 100 so it gives me a point blank range out past a bit to 125 or so.
Lots of good info in the 45th edition of the Lyman manual....in my opinion, the best manual ever printed for older cartridges. You can use any lightweight .224 bullet just load one at a time or do what I do sometimes.....make a jig and run a pointed bullet in a belt sander to flatten it.
I keep this rifle next to the back door and while I don't shoot healthy foxes anymore, I shoot mangy ones.----6
I too have a 218 Marlin and I affectionately call it my "cat rifle" but I've never shot a cat with it, only a mess of foxes and it drops them on the spot. My favorite all time load is 11.5 gr. of 2400 with the Hornady 45 gr. Bee....specifically made for the 218 Bee....... 12 grains of 4227 will do the same..... for a chronographed velocity of 2599. It's a tad under top velocity but I've learned a long time ago if you load just a little under, you don't lose much velocity, the animal don't know the difference and the brass lasts a lot longer as leverguns are less forgiving on high pressures than bolt guns are.
Do NOT use pistol primers for two reasons....one, they don't cost any less and two, the Bee cartridge is a high pressure cartridge and is small and 2/10th's of a grain increase will increase the pressures a whole lot more than they will in a larger case and you don't need gases blowing back through the primer in your face. The only time I would say it's OK is when your using cast gas checked bullets with 3 grains of Bullseye which I've done also with complete success. Even then I use rifle primers as the pistol primer is also a shallower primer which could lead to a light primer indentation which might lead to a misfire. The 218 Bee brass is deep measured for rifle primers.
I have always stayed with the 11.5 load as it works......1" at 100 and if I want something with less power, I'll use a .22 L.R. I've shot crows and foxes out to 150 yards with the Bee.....have it sighted dead on for 100 so it gives me a point blank range out past a bit to 125 or so.
Lots of good info in the 45th edition of the Lyman manual....in my opinion, the best manual ever printed for older cartridges. You can use any lightweight .224 bullet just load one at a time or do what I do sometimes.....make a jig and run a pointed bullet in a belt sander to flatten it.
I keep this rifle next to the back door and while I don't shoot healthy foxes anymore, I shoot mangy ones.----6
Last edited by Sixgun on Tue May 30, 2017 8:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- earlmck
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
I'm sort of a Bee shooter but have no info for you -- my Bee isn't allowed to shoot jacketed bullets. But I see Six has some good experience with loading j-types in the Bee,though you might want to take 'em with a grain of salt as I'm pretty sure he was smoking or drinking something when he posted because his rant on the primers doesn't seem to have come from a the normally sober person we know Six to be. I'm pretty sure all the old geezers on Leverguns know that the height difference pistol primer vs. rifle primer is found in the Large size, not the Small size that is the Bee. And unless you have a big old blunt black powder sized firing pin/firing pin hole you are not going to be able to get a small pistol primer to blow through with any pressure the gun will hold, so use whatever primer you feel like. Though I would use the rifle primer for sure if using H110 (I don't know if it also applies to N110 but probably does) because some of these ball powders can resist the ministrations of a small pistol primer and H110 has done that to me.
Big congrats on snagging that deal, jdad.
Big congrats on snagging that deal, jdad.
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
You got a heck of a deal!! Again, I NEVER find deals like that!
Now my Bee has a lever but it's a Ruger #1, I think the only deal I ever found, LNIB with bushnell 3-9 that I dropped $375 on. Came with a couple hundred factory loads.
The load I settled on is 13-13.5 of 4227 with a 40 gr Vmax. No need to use the 46 Bee bullets with a single shot.
I use rifle primers- it's a rifle.i also use rifle in my hornet. Pistol primers in pistol calibers. Primer of choice is the Federal gold medal match.
I haven't done velocity testing yet.
Now my Bee has a lever but it's a Ruger #1, I think the only deal I ever found, LNIB with bushnell 3-9 that I dropped $375 on. Came with a couple hundred factory loads.
The load I settled on is 13-13.5 of 4227 with a 40 gr Vmax. No need to use the 46 Bee bullets with a single shot.
I use rifle primers- it's a rifle.i also use rifle in my hornet. Pistol primers in pistol calibers. Primer of choice is the Federal gold medal match.
I haven't done velocity testing yet.
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
Thanks Six,
The Sierra 46gr I have is specifically made for the Bee also. I'll stick with the small rifle primers and give 4227 & 2400 a try tomorrow. It's just a range toy, so I'll play with the steel critters.
Doc,
I found plenty of Hornady brass, at a real fair price, at Gunstop.com. $87 shipped for two 50ct boxes.
The Sierra 46gr I have is specifically made for the Bee also. I'll stick with the small rifle primers and give 4227 & 2400 a try tomorrow. It's just a range toy, so I'll play with the steel critters.
Doc,
I found plenty of Hornady brass, at a real fair price, at Gunstop.com. $87 shipped for two 50ct boxes.
I know a whole lot about very little and nothing about a whole lot.
Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
So here's why I was asking.
The Speer book uses their 46gr jacketed FP
2400 - 8.3gr MAX
4227 - 9.8gr MAX
4198 - 14.2gr MAX (compressed)
The Hornady book uses their 45gr jacketed HP
2400 - 11.2gr MAX
H110 - 11.9gr MAX
4198 - 13.9gr MAX
The Speer book uses their 46gr jacketed FP
2400 - 8.3gr MAX
4227 - 9.8gr MAX
4198 - 14.2gr MAX (compressed)
The Hornady book uses their 45gr jacketed HP
2400 - 11.2gr MAX
H110 - 11.9gr MAX
4198 - 13.9gr MAX
I know a whole lot about very little and nothing about a whole lot.
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
This might help: https://sierrabulletsblog.com/2017/04/1 ... data-vary/
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
Personally I've never liked the mag pistol powders in the Bee. Pressures climb too fast for my tastes. IMR 4198 has been my favorite powder for my Ruger No.1 and my Browning 65 using cast or jacketed bullets. IMR fills the case with perfect load density. I found when using the H4198 I had to use a drop tube to fill the case. i've had the best accuracy with seating the bullets out as far as the rifle will accept. Even the 65 functions fine with 1.720" length cartridges from the magazine. With jacketed, I generally use the 45 gr. Hornet bullets from Sierra and Hornady because I have a lot of them on hand bought cheap from various sales over the years. But I have had great success with cast at 2600fps using the NOE 45gr.BRP mold @ .225"
- vancelw
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
Hornady is usually very conservative in their loads.
But on .32-20 rifle loads they list much hotter loads than any other manual does. Even the other manuals' HV loads.
They may have actually tested pressures instead of just dragging old assumptions forward.
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Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
I've been playing with it for the last 2 days. It does not like 2400.....surprised me too. 3" five-shot groups was the best it would do at 50 yards.
The closer to max I get with 4227 the tighter the groups get. Pretty impressed so far. I'm at 9.5gr right now, so I'll try 1/10 increments up and see if they tighten up.
I tried loading 4198, but it was a huge PITA, so I stopped.
The closer to max I get with 4227 the tighter the groups get. Pretty impressed so far. I'm at 9.5gr right now, so I'll try 1/10 increments up and see if they tighten up.
I tried loading 4198, but it was a huge PITA, so I stopped.
I know a whole lot about very little and nothing about a whole lot.
Re: .218 Bee reloading questions
The all-time best powder for the .218 Bee is W-W 296. I also have had good luck with the discontinued W-W 680, Ball-C(2) and Reloader 7. I never cared for either 2400 or 4227 in the Bee. I've owned and loaded for better than a dozen .218 Bee rifles over the years. Always wished that Ruger had chambered his Hawkeye pistol for this round instead of the odd-ball .256.