Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

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2BearArms
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Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#1 Post by 2BearArms » Wed May 10, 2017 2:45 pm

I thought I had posted some of this already but it looks like this may be my first post on here. I wrote this basic post last year but I guess I never posted it here. Because I can’t find any posts under my user name. So I am editing some of what I had originally wrote and am updating it.

I bought a used Rossi Puma saddle ring rifle 38/357 with a 20” barrel, last year. This is a pre safety model. It has a metal butt plate and I like the look. I read as much as I could about this type of rifle on here before buying it. It looks like it may have been updated to fix any of the known problems that I had read about. I should add here that it was last year that I read all of that and I and I don’t remember what the issues I had read were, except for the plastic follower in the ammo tube, this one has a metal follower. I got to shoot it a little bit after buying it. I am a bit of a rifle recoil wimp partially due to a shoulder injury from a MV accident. Shooting 38 even +p rounds in this rifle there is practically no recoil. But when I shot 357 Magnum rounds thru it with that metal butt plate it really hurts.

I think I am going to have to sacrifice the look and get a recoil absorbing buttstock pad if I want to shoot 357 round thru it. I bought one of the slip on ones at Brass Pro Shop but I haven’t had a chance to shoot it again. I like the look of the leather lace on ones more than the one I bought. I saw one that is relatively cheap and it isn’t really made for recoil absorption but maybe if I put one of the pads in it that came with the slip on one it will work enough for me. I mostly want functionality but I don’t want it to look too ugly.

The fellow I bought the rifle from said that he liked to always use hollow point ammo in it so that in the tube there was never a hard pointed tipped bullet resting against the primer of the round in front of it. How important is that? I just picked up some of the Polycase ARX rounds in 38 Special, mainly for a revolver and a derringer. I was thinking of trying them in the Rossi and was wondering if that is a bad idea? They have a small flat spot on the tip that would rest right into the primer of the round in front of it. I was thinking that if this were to be a problem it would most likely be with a round with more recoil to it, like a 357 Magnum round. Any suggestions or comments?

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#2 Post by Chuck 100 yd » Wed May 10, 2017 2:55 pm

Welcome to the forum !
Flat point ammo is prefered in tube magazines but large hollow points will work in a Rossi .357 also. Have fun.

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#3 Post by GunnyMack » Wed May 10, 2017 3:31 pm

Welcome!
What you DONT want is a pointed bullet. The average pistol bullet is flat nose and should be fine.
Check Boydes stocks, see if they make a replacement 'shotgun' style stock that fits the Puma, it will be a flat butt and may have a recoil pad to alleviate your recoil issue. The problem I see with your strap on pad is the length of pull could grow to long.

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#4 Post by 2BearArms » Wed May 10, 2017 4:07 pm

Thank you for the quick replies. The length of pull doesn’t seem to be an issue with the pad that I bought. But I can understand that being a concern for some people. But I guess my arms are long enough. They reach all the way down to my hands. :)

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#5 Post by AJMD429 » Wed May 10, 2017 4:14 pm

I don't have the information at hand right now but there is a recoil pad designed for the Ruger 10 / 22 that also extends the length of pull an inch or so for that little carbine. I think it is a 'Bob Maasen' or something. Anyway, MidwayUSA.com has them. They are inexpensive and also fit some of the other Ruger rifles such as the 96 series comma plus are a very close fit for the Rossi carbines. It's an inexpensive way to make the rifle much more user-friendly.
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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#6 Post by JerryB » Wed May 10, 2017 4:35 pm

Glad t hear you are enjoying you Rossi .357 carbine. Mine does 24-7 guard duty at the back door loaded with some heavy .38 special loads. If you reload you can load a 158 grain swc bullet pretty heavy and still not have the recoil of the magnum loads. Check the load books, I reckon you can buy heavy .38 loads too.
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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#7 Post by 2BearArms » Wed May 10, 2017 5:01 pm

AJMD429 wrote:
Wed May 10, 2017 4:14 pm
I don't have the information at hand right now but there is a recoil pad designed for the Ruger 10 / 22 that also extends the length of pull an inch or so for that little carbine. I think it is a 'Bob Maasen' or something. Anyway, MidwayUSA.com has them. They are inexpensive and also fit some of the other Ruger rifles such as the 96 series comma plus are a very close fit for the Rossi carbines. It's an inexpensive way to make the rifle much more user-friendly.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/425407 ... bber-black

I think this is what you were referring to. Most of the reviews seem to say it it too hard to be a recoil pad it is really just a length of pull extender.

Thank you for the recommendation I think I am looking for something different. I was going to go to the range today but that didn't work out for me so maybe next week I can try what I have and see how it works.

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#8 Post by Griff » Wed May 10, 2017 7:51 pm

Image and WELCOME to THE Forum.

The generally accepted wisdom is that one doesn't use pointed or round nose bullets in a tube magazine. Personally, I have no problem using hollow points, but prefer both RFN and TC (round flat nose & truncated cone) bullets best!
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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#9 Post by crs » Wed May 10, 2017 10:44 pm

My model 1892 has a hard plastic butt plate but it has never made my shoulder sore , even when shooting from a bench rest. mmm?

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#10 Post by mikld » Thu May 11, 2017 10:53 am

I wanted a bit more pull on my Puma's stock and some relief from recoil (.44 Mag) so I got a leather butt pad like the lace on one here. https://www.buffaloarms.com/shooting-su ... -butt-pads the lace on "cowboy looking" I put about 3/4" of foam rubber inside and laced it on. Worked good for me and looks "period"...
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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#11 Post by 2BearArms » Wed May 17, 2017 11:54 pm

Well I got to the range today (well since it is after midnight here technically it was yesterday) and I tried out the slip on black recoil pad that I bought. And I could definitely tell the difference between the 38 rounds and the 357. The 357 didn’t hurt to shoot like it did without the pad. So I am happy about that. I may still buy one of the leather ones and put a pad from the slip on one inside of it.

I also got a chance to try the Polycase ARX ammo. I shot the 38 in both the Rossi lever gun and a snub nose revolver (one of the S&W air weights) in the Rossi it felt like a standard 38. I don’t see the benefits of using it in the Rossi and it scares me a little bit how the little flay nose part of the round fits perfectly inside of the primer of the round in front of it. It didn’t seem to me to shoot any lighter in the revolver then the Liberty ammo (Civil Defense) light weight rounds I have been carrying lately. The revolver is not a comfortable gun to shoot. But the size and weight make it a good everyday carry gun. I also tried the ARX 380 ammo in my Walther PPK-S and it made a lot of difference, it made it a lot smoother to shoot. I did have a little bit of trouble with it with an aftermarket mag. So the jury is still out as to whether I can trust it for carrying. I will have to play with it some more soon.

Any ammo I have used feeds and ejects from the Rossi without any problems. I don’t think I have developed the proper technique for loading the rounds into the tube magazine. I struggle a bit to get them in and especially as it gets up to capacity. I seem to need to use my pinky to get each round in so it doesn’t just pop back out. I have tried using another round to push the previous one in, but it feels a little bit funny pushing on the round that much with another round.

I loaded a few rounds in towards the end of my time at the range and I started with a leftover 357 round and then put in a few 38 rounds. As I fired the first round I thought that it don’t seem very powerful for a 357 and when I shot the last round that was actually the 357 round it dawned on me that it is first in last out. Oops. :oops:

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#12 Post by AJMD429 » Thu May 18, 2017 3:57 am

There is definitely an 'art' to loading leverguns. Often you can just push the round in until it almost is in all the way, with the rim still holding the loading gate open. Then push the case the rest of the way with the next round. Only the last round will require the 'pinky' treatment.

The first-in-last-out phenomenon has befuddled me a time or two. Sometimes nice to leave day five rounds loaded in the gun of 357 Mag, for things that go bump in the night, then if you head out to practice, slip in five more rounds - of 38 Special. Shoot those five and reload five more, etc. Leave the hotter ones in the whole time.

Another thought on recoil with the metal buttplare: The 454 Casull models come with a built-in rubber (?) recoil pad. The stock should fit the receiver just fine I think.

Check with NKJ on that (either PM him or use his website). If I'm right, ordering a rear stock for the 454 Casual Rossi might be the nicest-looking option.
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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#13 Post by Malamute » Thu May 18, 2017 11:24 am

Are you having trouble getting each individual entire round in all the way or having trouble getting the next one started into the gate?

Ive used the "dont push each one all the way in until the last one" but feel its generally a poor substitute for pushing each one all the way in with a properly functioning gun thats easy to get fresh loads into the gate. Ive have one or several rounds pop back out the gate. All that is unecessary when the gun works right.
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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#14 Post by 2BearArms » Mon May 22, 2017 12:25 pm

Malamute wrote:
Thu May 18, 2017 11:24 am
Are you having trouble getting each individual entire round in all the way or having trouble getting the next one started into the gate?

Ive used the "dont push each one all the way in until the last one" but feel its generally a poor substitute for pushing each one all the way in with a properly functioning gun thats easy to get fresh loads into the gate. Ive have one or several rounds pop back out the gate. All that is unecessary when the gun works right.
I just pulled the Rossi out of the safe and played around with some 357 snap caps just now to see exactly what my problem is. And I think it is just my technique. Each round goes in fine it is just that last little bit I have to push each round in so it stays. I just need to get a fingertip in enough to do that. Or use another round to push it in. With the snap caps I have no concern with doing that. With regular rounds I am not crazy about using one round to push another round in. I recently had a factory round that just carrying it around I noticed that the bullet was slightly recessed more than it should be into the brass so I gently pushed the bullet and it went all the way into the brass. I guess they didn’t crimp it enough, they probably figured that their 38spl rounds would just be used in revolvers. This one round was exceptionally loose though.

It does obviously get harder to push them in as you get more of them in as with any magazine, when you get to the last ones they can get hard to get them in. I think the other slight factor I had was the range I was at is extremely fussy about the weapons always pointing at the targets not into the ground at all and I find it easier to load in the rounds while holding the gun down at about a 45 degree angle. I still would keep it aimed down range but into the ground, this is outdoors. But they don’t like that so I tried to load it while it was laying on the bench aimed down range. And as I said at the beginning of this I think I need to work on my technique.

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Re: Should I always use only hollow point ammo in a tube feed center fire rifle?

#15 Post by jkbrea » Mon May 22, 2017 2:04 pm

Didn't a member here conduct a test to debunk the theory that pointed bullets wouldn't hit hard enough to detonate the primer in front of it? It was a couple years back I recall. I know there is a video of leverevolution ammo where they drop a rifle from different heights to show the pointy rubber tips are safe. That said, I'm sure it has occurred or it wouldn't be an issue. The small gain in distance wouldn't justify chancing it, at least for me. If you have to use pointy bullets for hunting, just load one in the chamber and one in the mag.

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